Royal Panda roulette

Author Topic: Still the same H.E.?  (Read 1504 times)

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mr j

Still the same H.E.?
« on: December 02, 2018, 02:25:00 AM »
At C. Casino (where I practice), they switch wheel & ball direction every spin. I believe some B&M also do the same (?) Where I play (B&M) and MOST other casinos, it all stays the same direction.

 I have read (from other posters) that it is more difficult to play their style of game on the alternating wheel/ball tables. So the question becomes, does your H.E. increase because of those conditions?

 Point being, you cant have it both ways (imo). You cant say it is MORE DIFFICULT winning on the alternating wheel/ball tables BUT the H.E. stays exactly the same.

 Ken
 

palestis

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2018, 03:04:10 AM »
All US B+M casinos spin in one (CW) direction.  But the ball is released at the dealer's discretion.
For VB (visual ballistics) purposes, you have to wait until the ball is released to see what number is above the ball release point. Then you got very little time to estimate the landing zone (if the speeds are the same), and make the bet.
In European casinos they spin in alternate directions. But the ball starts exactly above the LAST NUMBER spun.
So you have plenty of time to figure out the next landing area (if speeds remain the same).
 You will already know the landing zone area. All you have to wait for is to make sure the speeds are the same. The betting takes very little time since you already  know the landing zone and have prepared for it.
Alternating direction is not a problem. it's an advantage.
A dealer might change speeds in CCW direction, but he might be much more consistent in CW directions. Or the other way around.
You pick the direction where you detect dealer's signature.
 

mr j

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2018, 03:19:20 AM »
"Alternating direction is not a problem. it's an advantage" >> This is where you need to be careful. 

Advantage = a lower H.E.? If no, then is it an advantage?
 

palestis

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2018, 03:34:27 AM »
It is clear that by advantage i meant 2 directions vs. 1 direction. Nothing to do with the HE. The HE is not affected by spin direction.
 

mr j

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2018, 03:36:47 AM »
*WHAT* is that "advantage"? More clearly please. Advantage for the casino?
 

palestis

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2018, 04:13:03 AM »

Hmmmmm.
By having to chose from 2 directions its an advantage for the player. Because some dealers tend to be consistent in a centain spinning direction. Coupled with the fact that you know in advance the ball starting point.
All you need to do is monitor the dealers to find the right one.
Once you find him you reduce an entire circle
(The wheel), to an arc of 10-12 numbers.
At least long enough to make a profit and walk away.
 Classic VB system.
 

mr j

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2018, 04:35:36 AM »
 "its an advantage for the player" >> So back to square one. Can the H.E. remain the SAME and you still have an advantage? I say no.
 

palestis

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2018, 04:57:57 AM »
The HE remains the same if you have to chose among 37 numbers. Reducing the choice to an arc of 10-12 numbers The HE obviously becomes negative for the casino. Or better yet there is no HE. Then it becomes HD. (House Disadvantage).  But only for the duration the dealer's signature is in effect and the player takes advantage if it.
Im sure Mike or Mr.Perfect can tell you more about it.

 

MickyP

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2018, 05:11:17 AM »
"its an advantage for the player" >> So back to square one. Can the H.E. remain the SAME and you still have an advantage? I say no.

Ken, the HE is constant no matter what you do with the ball. The house edge is calculated on the uneven payout on the wheel type; single zero or double zero.

Advantage is player ability to read and capitalize on identified criteria that will "possibly produce a profitable hit rate.
Long run, short run, virtual or whatever, the HE is fixed (a short payout) Nothing changes this fact.

 
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mr j

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2018, 05:45:51 AM »
"that will "possibly produce a profitable hit rate" >> Then that would lower the H.E.
 

MickyP

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2018, 05:53:21 AM »
Nothing will lower the house edge. It is factored into every bet placed. Palestis gave a good explanation as did MrPerfect in another thread.
When playing even chance it's not a 50/50 chance due to the house edge.
 

mr j

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2018, 05:54:41 AM »
A person who has a lucky day and wins $900. He does not say, he had an advantage, correct?

There is NO WAY you can say you have an advantage and the H.E. remained the same (for you).
 

MickyP

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2018, 06:05:02 AM »
Lol, I see what you mean.

You always have the house edge but you can create an advantage. Payout remains a Disadvantage on every win.
 
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gizmotron

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2018, 06:15:15 AM »
At C. Casino (where I practice), they switch wheel & ball direction every spin. I believe some B&M also do the same (?) Where I play (B&M) and MOST other casinos, it all stays the same direction.

 I have read (from other posters) that it is more difficult to play their style of game on the alternating wheel/ball tables. So the question becomes, does your H.E. increase because of those conditions?

 Point being, you cant have it both ways (imo). You cant say it is MORE DIFFICULT winning on the alternating wheel/ball tables BUT the H.E. stays exactly the same.

 Ken

I've got so many bazillion spins under my belt in the past 40 years that I just know the answer here. The moron sending the ball and the wheel speed are so different with regard to physics that the chance of consistency is nearly impossible. You don't believe this perhaps? I can tell you as a recording engineer that the very best musicians in the world can't send it with perfect consistency. And they are without consideration the very best. Do many of you think that this is bullsh*t? The micro seconds with regards to expert timing is so hard to produce that hundreds of hours are spent reconstructing the perfect pitch and timing in the mix. Just look up the magic of Antares Auto Tune on Youtube and check out the incredible aspect of thousandth per second variations just in the recording process. And that is people trying to get it perfect. It's a joke that dealers are magnificent when it comes to intentional timing. And what if they don't intend to get it perfect? You guys in the magic belief systems are really good when it comes to magic. Thanks for the laughs.  You are 45 microseconds off and that is just a little bit beyond the Haas Zone. People suck compared to the perfect timing of micro second processing. AP people with regards to timing hits are the funniest people in bozo land. There is no way they can do it without a computer. And that depends on perfect triggering too. Ha Ha.
 
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MickyP

Re: Still the same H.E.?
« Reply #14 on: December 02, 2018, 06:45:58 AM »
Thanks for the laugh Gizmo.
AP stands for Advantage Play and I've questioned the advantage without the use of aids. (Computers, timers). One can also question how accurate  reading ball bounce is.