Roulette Forum

Roulette Forum => Roulette Strategy Discussion => Topic started by: Real on September 11, 2017, 05:19:31 PM

Title: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 11, 2017, 05:19:31 PM
Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.

Post them here.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 11, 2017, 07:57:10 PM
I really don't see the point why someone would waste time to criticize something that,  in his opinion, doesn't work instead of trying to pursue or share what works.

Relentless criticism can deter members from sharing their ideas and systems. This is not something I guess, this is a complain I have received more than once from various members. Some of them, like juice, even left the forum for good.

So when Janusz asked me to move the topic to the System Players Forum, that is only open to members who are seriously interested in and respect other member's systems, so he can explain his ideas without distractions, I wholeheartedly agreed.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 11, 2017, 09:01:48 PM
I have done threads on this before. Is it PLAYABLE at an actual casino under actual casino conditions??

You can show me ten great methods on paper. It doesn't mean a %*$&^#@%* thing to me, I'm not impressed.

Too many numbers, calculate how many chips per number(?), how many spins, "the lines must cross each other", blah blah blah. Can you do all that in under ten seconds? No? (rofl)

Belly up to an actual casino with an actual BR and play like a man. GUT? (lol)

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 11, 2017, 09:36:02 PM
I appreciate systems that are designed for pure RNG and I play pure RNG.  Pure RNG IS RNG just like a wheel, minus the imperfections. :shrug:

I realize I am in the minority and I accept that.  I am not a popularity contest, I am just myself.

I know of winning systems played on RNG & successful strategies for regular withdrawals on select casinos that can be trusted.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 11, 2017, 09:47:25 PM
Can "pure RNG" deny to pay you if you went on a nice winning streak?

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 11, 2017, 09:50:12 PM
I admit I'm an old fashioned player like MrJ
But it has nothing to do with manliness :-)
I wish I could be more flexible.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 11, 2017, 10:23:43 PM
In the real world of roulette, there is no "repeat bet" button.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 11, 2017, 10:46:58 PM
Kav, Reyth,

I don't know why it is that you two are so moderation "happy."

The way you guys over moderate, move, and delete thread creates chaos here.

@Mr. J...

Since our mighty moderators have taken it upon themselve to delete the thread where we were discussing the GUT, most of what's posted now doesn't make sense, is out of context, or is off track from the original discussion.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 11, 2017, 10:49:29 PM
I really don't see the point why someone would waste time to criticize something that,  in his opinion, doesn't work instead of trying to pursue or share what works. 

Maybe if you'd read the thread before deleting it you'd understand why. 

Quote
Relentless criticism can deter members from sharing their ideas and systems. This is not something I guess, this is a complain I have received more than once from various members. Some of them, like juice, even left the forum for good.

Without the facts dumb ideas gain traction, people may quit there jobs chasing them...etc.   However if you'd like to keep a safe space where the blissfully ignorant can stay that way then more power to you.  However, in five years you're forum will look just like it does now, and just like it did five years ago.  Completely void of a working system with the Martingales, triggers, and everyone still searching for "just the right progression."   But perhaps you're goal is to sell systems, rather than trying to win money...and for that you'll need a forum of mentally challenged desperate people.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 11, 2017, 11:00:41 PM
The purpose of this forum is to discuss roulette with emphasis on system play.

Forums exist for a purpose.  People that flaunt posts that interfere with that purpose are called TROLLS.

You are intelligent and there is no need for you to disrespect this forum, but you choose to anyway.

Apologies but you don't have the right to TROLL this forum and then complain about how corrective action is taken, it is done in the spirit of the purpose of this forum.

It is Kav's open-mindedness and kindness that allows you to use this forum.  Some people are highly offended by your behavior and some have left or refuse to post because of it.

At what point does open-mindedness and kindness become contrary to the purpose of a forum space?  Usually when people who already know better, push things too far. 
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 11, 2017, 11:15:48 PM
The reason that some of us correct the mistakes of others is the same reason that a school teacher does so in the classroom.  It's so that everyone may learn.

(https://sensiblechinese.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/asic_equation-copy.png)

School teachers aren't trolls, and neither are more experienced gambler's and mathematicians. Take the opportunity to learn from the experience and mistakes of others as you will not live long enough to make all of the mistakes yourselves.   

By the way, the forum process works best when you guys don't chop up the threads so much.  A little less moderation would go a long way towards improving your forum, will alienate fewer people and help prevent visitors from being so disconnected.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 12, 2017, 02:46:36 AM


Since our mighty moderators have taken it upon themselve to delete the thread where we were discussing the GUT, most of what's posted now doesn't make sense, is out of context, or is off track from the original discussion.[/b]

Yes, I see my GUT post is missing. Kav, I was not insulting GUT per say, just saying how under casino conditions its not playable and therefore should be labeled as such. How can one be interested in a method that SOLELY wins on paper or RNG?

How does that help anyone? Member Real has a point regarding all the deleting. Its one thing if its foul language etc.

Can a GUT player show me how its done (at least in theory) where everything is calculated and bets placed in under ten seconds on EVERY spin? If not, why would anyone even talk about the method? Methods must MATCH casino conditions. I'm sorry but this is the truth.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 12, 2017, 07:37:17 AM
Real,
A forum certainly doesn't get better if each and every system idea is descending to a "no system works, play the wheel" debate.

Most of your posts are non productive. You criticize without presenting an alternative.
Mr Perfect for example, though not a system player, has offered much more info about how he approaches roulette. There is a VB section in the forum. I never see you posting there, sharing your wisdom.

I really want you to be part of the forum but please try to do more good than harm.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: dobbelsteen on September 12, 2017, 08:03:00 AM
Where can I find the explanation the GUT does not work??
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 12, 2017, 09:19:33 AM
Where is this GUT system anyway? is it explained on this forum?

Quote
Can a GUT player show me how its done (at least in theory) where everything is calculated and bets placed in under ten seconds on EVERY spin? If not, why would anyone even talk about the method? Methods must MATCH casino conditions. I'm sorry but this is the truth.

Isn't the first order of business to find out if the system works? If it's worth playing then you could always play at live wheels online using a spreadsheet or software to do the calculations.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 12, 2017, 10:25:35 AM
Quote
Real,
Most of your posts are non productive. You criticize without presenting an alternative.
Kav ,
Look for example -  all look for some treasure,  and in front of them is forest, full of plagues  and all who will enter to forest, can be killed by them.

One man know where is treasure, but he not want to say , but he see, that you all  ready to enter that fores,t  which is exstremely dangerous and he say  - here are no treasure !

Maybe he saved your and other life, but you say, that he is very bad man, because he not said where exact is that treasure !

You think, that your position is good ?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 12, 2017, 12:31:27 PM
Bebe,
My question is:
"I heard you the first time; what's the point to repeat yourself that "there is no treasure" to death? Again and again and again and again. And why warn me anyway? Do you really care about me?"
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 12, 2017, 12:54:47 PM
You know, that for me the same, what you do, and i not try you to protect from possible loss , but are others and they  repeat many times maybe only because they not understand, how others cant understand :)

But you must understand that forums in which are no such persons as Real sooner or later will die, I saw such.... is imposible to talk always about what not exsist.... but if you still talk, that not hinder to me.....
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 12, 2017, 01:33:41 PM
I saw forums die because people like Ken and herb did destroy them.

The newest "GamblingForums" Roulette site.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 12, 2017, 02:46:47 PM
Both Herb and Ken ( lately) speak on forums very reasonable things. There are not so much people who actually do it... folks who do, give new people to the game the chance.  It's what happened to me, 5 years ego l was a newbuy,  with help of people like them l managed to avoid some of whatever mistakes that everyone do and actually stay at the game.
   Now l on forums do the same... helping others to avoid major traps and time wasting.. 
    " do not go there " is a best advice, lm a living example of someone actually following it, and who knows how many others.
    Forums die because of lies... l hope this one will survive long.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 12, 2017, 02:50:05 PM
I saw forums die because people like Ken and herb did destroy them.


"Ken" has kept more forums above water than you ever will.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: thelaw on September 12, 2017, 02:51:00 PM

I saw forums die because people like Ken and herb did destroy them.

The newest "GamblingForums" Roulette site.
Although I agree with this statement, as a new member @ GF I currently have already seen 1 of my posts completely disappear with no explanation, and another still "in moderation" since Friday.

Apparently, the mods are mia over there. :o
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 12, 2017, 03:01:04 PM
    Forums die because of lies... l hope this one will survive long.

What about these lies?:

Quote
Winkel's method is built upon a spoof...a bogus story.  There is no prove that it works, any where and there never will be for reasons which should already be obvious to everyone that grasps basic probability.

and this:

Quote
Winkel's method is built upon a spoof...a bogus story.  There is no prove that it works, any where and there never will be for reasons which should already be obvious to everyone that grasps basic probability.

He never ever knew what GUT is about. He is chasing me since 2004!
If Ken Mr.J and Real and all their other nicknames are the good people, who are the bad then?

Do they now talk abaout facts?
Do they crtizise constructive?
Do they any review?
Do they proof that GUT fails?
Do and did they ever refer to other arguments than their own?

NO!

What they do is to bash the forum.
They do bash the mods.
They do behave like obnoxious children.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 12, 2017, 03:32:25 PM
Is this you Janusz?

g-u-t (dot) co
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 12, 2017, 03:39:06 PM
No! These guys have stolen my explanations and sell it as e-book!
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 12, 2017, 03:59:23 PM
Janusz, lies are bla..bla..bla that lead nowhere. Look what happend to foresters forum, ones biggest comunity out there wich was progressive..  just because guy felt to assept his own mistakes and posed himself as active player, forum died.
   This kind of lies!!! That's why lm here and do my best to guide anyone needing it. Of course maintenance of smoke screen is important to preserve a game itself, yet l do belive in cooperation and giving situable individuals a chance. I have been offered it myself and l belive many do deserve one as well.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 12, 2017, 04:46:03 PM
Quote
No! These guys have stolen my explanations and sell it as e-book!

Righto then. Google search brings up quite a few hits, can you provide a link to your original explanations? Thankyou.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 12, 2017, 05:22:05 PM
look at vls rouletteforum
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 12, 2017, 05:24:41 PM
I'm not sure as to why people are talking about the death of roulette forums.  Yes they come and go, but right now there's probably more of them than ever.

The cycle is:

1. Excited young naive gamblers build a roulette forum
2. Others join...including system seller gypsies
3. Knowledge information stagnates
4. Members lose money
5. Members lose interest
6. Forum dies
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 12, 2017, 05:27:42 PM
Quote
9. No "baiting", which is where you brag about how great your system is, but you don't share anything except perhaps obscure details that lead people along. The forum is a place for open sharing. If you "bait" people, expect to be banned.

Bayes wrote: "When you published your GUT system on VLS years ago, Kon-Fu-Sed simulated it and it failed. Your response was to say that you need to apply "gambler's intelligence" in order to make it work. But you never defined what "gambler's intelligence" actually is. Ever since then, you've continued to claim that the system works, but have never clearly explained how to play it. A prime example of obscure details that lead people along.

I don't believe there's such a rule on this forum, but I think there should be. I've explained why I think it's a good rule on the other forum."
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 12, 2017, 05:29:22 PM
McCoy,
 This (https://www.roulette-bet.com/2017/01/great-universal-theory-gut-system-by.html) a fast and rough summary without reading dozens of roulette forum posts.

--

I think MrPerfect is a great example of someone who is not a "system player" yet:
I encourage everyone who is interested in Visual Ballistics and Advantage Play to take part with questions and comments in the Visual Ballistics board (https://www.roulettelife.com/index.php?board=17.0), where MrPerfect does a great job sharing his knowledge. I would love Real to take part in the discussions there.
Here are some recent topics:---

Quote
They do behave like obnoxious children.
This is often my perception too. And although I avoid pointing fingers, I'm speaking about Real. I'm not getting tired of different opinions. But I demand that everyone respects everyone else - lack of respect is something I can not stand. And everyone who spends time and effort to write a meaningful post deserves respect IMO, whether someone else agrees or not with the content.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: scepticus on September 12, 2017, 05:39:53 PM


We all think that our approach is as good as anyone else's. The main dissenters are the AP in this forum .They dismiss all Methods without " Discussion " . They promote their version of AP and insult anyone who differs.
Real claimed that this forum was no longer in business and yet continues to post in it ! He gave his Ebook for free to those in the forum who were interested in his method -so why not publish it in the forum  if he is here to " educate " us."?  Mr . Perfect claims that he too. is here to " educate " us - yet uses the Moon's phases to aid his predictions . What have they to offer when they wrongly believe that THEY don't gamble  ?
Abuse begets abuse .
kav is right. There is a need for  more tolerance of other's views . Theree is NO  HG and it is foolish to claim otherwise.
kav . Mr. perfect doesn't derogate others ? Really ?
He doesn't derogate others when he  says that those who are lazydon't deserve the title of Human ? Really?
He didn't derogate me when he made  his vile post calling me a liar etc..Really ?
What do you consider as " abuse " ?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 12, 2017, 05:45:20 PM
Scepticus, none is calling you a liar, it was a mistake if it happened. This forum is against PERSONAL attacks. Period.
Part of the problem is also that many of us take criticism personally, instead of taking it for what is worth and moving on.

About GUT:
Winkel/Janusz is not obliged to offer us a winning method. Anyone can take it for what it is worth to him. If you think it's worthless, forget it. If you feel it is worth something, discuss it. Simple as that.

About TEASING

There IS a rule on this forum about people who claim a lot and share nothing, also called the "put up or shut up" rule :-). But if someone, even without revealing their system completely, offers enough info for people to be provoked to do their own thinking then he is actually offering something useful. Especially if one doesn't overdo the "claim" part. I don't understand why someone feels so upset if people discuss systems, even systems that are not fully revealed (like thomasleor or Talos) or systems that in his opinion "do not work".
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 12, 2017, 06:40:46 PM
Quote
Real claimed that this forum was no longer in business and yet continues to post in it !

Where? What? When?  I've never said such a thing.

Quote

He gave his Ebook for free to those in the forum who were interested in his method -so why not publish it in the forum  if he is here to " educate " us."? 

I haven't freely given anyone here on this forum an E book, and I don't have one to share.
Quote

He didn't derogate me when he made  his vile post calling me a liar etc..Really ?

He may not have, however, I'm considering using the term. 
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: scepticus on September 12, 2017, 06:47:28 PM

1 ) In another forum in your guise as " The General ".
2 )Harry J said you had sent him it .
So why do you deny it ? Not lying of course - just forgetfulness ?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: scepticus on September 12, 2017, 06:51:00 PM

kav
Calling someone a liar is a " Mistake " ? Really ?
You complain about Real's persistent putdowns yet allow Mr. Perfect ? Hardly being even-handed is it ?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 12, 2017, 06:53:32 PM
Quote
1 ) In another forum in your guise as " The General ".
2 )Harry J said you had sent him it .
So why do you deny it ? Not lying of course - just forgetfulness ?

Please provide a link.  I never said such a thing.

And who's Harry J.?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 12, 2017, 07:00:45 PM
Getting back on topic:

The GUT didn't work because each crossing failed to perform.  Each defined crossing lost at the house edge as expected.
If each crossing losses, then the sum of all crossing is also going to be a net loser.  This is what Kon Fu Sed had tested and concluded.

In the end it was determined that the GUT appeared to work because of faulty testing that enabled the user to look backwards and forwards during the testing process to find which crossing worked the best.  The flaw was not intentional and was obviously an unintentional consequence.  In my opinion Winkel did not try to mislead anyone, but rather other people misled themselves by continuing the curve fitting process while testing the system.

 Winkel still claims the system works, but can't define the latest rules of the system, because doing so would enable someone like Kon Fu to once again demonstrate that it won't work.  His claim is that it relies on the human element.  It's possible that he honestly doesn't realize that it doesn't work because he too has fallen victim to the curve fitting process.

Curve fitting is a common problem when inexperienced players test systems without carefully defining the rules of the system, test parameters, and limit the degrees of freedom being tested.

I have no personal vendetta against Winkel, and I wish him well.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: scepticus on September 12, 2017, 07:27:13 PM

Offhand I can't recall the name of the forum. When you said that this forum no longer existed another member asked why you hadn't saved it -because of your self -  proclaimed  expertise. In that forum you also claimed that you owned some roulette forums and was on the lookout for more. Your " mugshot " was as in this forum.
So you deny posting as The General ?
As for not knowing Harry J other members will see my point about your " forgetfulness " because you wished him well during his illness .
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: scepticus on September 12, 2017, 07:34:13 PM

Real
If I remember rightly the member who replied to you  was Roulette Ghost,
If he reads this perhaps he will confirm what I said ?
Or if  a member here knows him perhaps he will ask him the truthfulness of my claim ?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 12, 2017, 07:36:57 PM
Scepticus,

1. I don't own any roulette forums.
2. I now know which Harry you're referring to, but I never sent him a copy of a book.

Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 13, 2017, 03:24:54 AM
Curve fitting is a common problem when inexperienced players test systems without carefully defining the rules of the system, test parameters, and limit the degrees of freedom being tested.

I have no personal vendetta against Winkel, and I wish him well.

Curve fitting is not a problem for SYSTEM TESTING, it is a facet of STRATEGY DESIGN.  I believe your post, like most of them, is disingenuous and therefore probably inaccurate.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 13, 2017, 09:41:58 AM
Curve fitting is good only to determine how to bet, to determine what to bet it's a very misleading thing.
   So, for betting plan-yes, Yes, YES!!! For betting target- VERY BIG "NO WAY".
   Take as example foresters RC, it has multiple samples and in play it try to " fit the curve" for timings to determine wich sample is to choose as reference for current spin in play. It's a major reason why users of such RC loose. Instead of looking to to curve fitt for most spins it looks " ideal sample " that current spin correspond the most. Well, reason for unnecessary exteniton of dispersion where none of this should exist.
    Instead of curve fitting , consistency tests should be performed,  hipotesys testing, like separate sample ( data) in many parts , use first to define rulls and second part to test performance. ..ets.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 13, 2017, 11:49:12 AM
I'm not a ninja in system creation, l just follow the wheel and ball. But even for systems, first need to have a system , next is to test it ..  at least l see it this way.
  If one has a system with flexible rules that are fitted as you go and depends on " human factor", it's not nessesarely mean that a system is good, probably system designer is lucky and gess very well, especially if results of such a system can not be replicated by others.
    It's easy to create logically sounding system for any data collection by curve fitting, but such a system needs to be multiple times retested on other data collections to determine real potential for performance. 
   Just my 50 cents. ..
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: RouletteGhost on September 13, 2017, 12:37:37 PM
You guys beat things to death

It's not productive. It is annoying

Why do you care if people play a certain strategy

You don't like gut so don't play it

Clear to see you are just tying to get under people's skin. Life that boring? Who cares how people decide to play

All you guys do is criticize day in and day out

Stop talking about gut.

Actually, to be honest, constantly criticizing gut makes you look wanting.

(https://media2.giphy.com/media/aDFOeb4MJ1K00/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: dobbelsteen on September 13, 2017, 02:38:18 PM
@MRperfect. A system has always fixed else it is not a system. Flexible rules based on human factors together with a system is a method.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 13, 2017, 10:30:21 PM
Nothing but a polite comment.....there are TWO rules (imo) for this GUT (or any method).

First, does it work? I dont care about 874 million spins. It either works or it doesn't. Lets pretend its a YES.

Second and *MOST* important....is it PLAYABLE at a real casino?

Always think of the TEN second rule. With your method > calculate which numbers to bet per spin, for how many spins, how many chips and PLACE those bets in under ten seconds.... and thats every spin.

You cant? Then your method is ______________ << I cant say what I want, I dont want it deleted. This is the difference between ACTUAL serious ballers at the casino and...well...the rest (sorry). I can sit here and post six silly methods that are pretty bad a** but not playable. So what do I do? I scrap it and never mess with it again.

(regarding the ten second rule), something to understand. If you TRULY have a great method and pit etc. sees this? Your spin times WILL get shorter. This is a fact !!! Bet 18 numbers? HaHaHa

Good luck with that.

 I read so many ODD methods at "other" boards, they never calculate everything and at the end of the day...its a HG!! (rofl) (rofl)  A few of them, you only bet after certain triggers. Okay, but what is your average number of SKIPPED spins?

Its 40 spins per hour (average) at the casino. Soooo you add in the skipped spins and your HOURLY net win rate just dropped off a cliff but wait wait wait, that wont get talked about.

Everything tested MUST MATCH actual casino conditions. Do I need to post this in French or Spanish or something?

Again, its the difference between a professional player and "some guy" waiving his hat in the air yelling YIPPEE YIPPEE another HG is born and screw the members that know more. Until most (not all) of you guys start to understand the *BASICS*, you will be stuck for years and years to come.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 13, 2017, 11:21:57 PM
I knew I was forgetting something, I usually do. They also do testing where the mins and max bets dont match up with your average casino.

Like a 7 step Marty....the last bets for those two columns are like 783 chips (lol).

Come on!!! These types of posts/methods are strictly for entertainment purposes.  How do you guys take this stuff seriously?

Then....it'll be run through a bunch of trials (it passes) and proclaimed HG HG HG. Completely ignoring REAL CASINO situations.

Here is the bad news....if we eliminate ALL goofy ideas and take into account actual casino conditions.....the truth is, there is LITTLE left. This is a sad fact folks. If you are an honest person, you will have very little to work with after eliminations. This is the *MAIN* reason people ignore reality. They want tons of false avenues to pursue their new roulette ideas.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 13, 2017, 11:25:05 PM
This is all 100% true, from the perspective of someone that only plays in a B&M casino.

None of it applies to me or say people that play a B&M wheel online?  GUT can be played in both RNG & live wheel.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: TheGenner on September 13, 2017, 11:36:40 PM

Always think of the TEN second rule.

Wrong! Spins are independent trials! Y/N. Therefore nothing to stop anybody playing every second spin to give themselves a bit more thinking time.

Have a nice day and try not to think too hard.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 13, 2017, 11:49:12 PM
The poster above me...try and read all that I wrote. The ten second rule is what? Its not what you are replying to.

"Spins are independent trials" has nothing to do with what I posted....figures.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 13, 2017, 11:56:10 PM
This is all 100% true, from the perspective of someone that only plays in a B&M casino.

None of it applies to me or say people that play a B&M wheel online?  GUT can be played in both RNG & live wheel.

I can meet you half way in regards to B&M online such as...C. Casino (dont know if I can post the entire name?) ...but at C. Casino, you STILL have mins and a max and they spin every 40-50 seconds. You cant escape that.

RNG online? Come on Reyth, you're better than that man(?) Avoid online (actual wheel) where camera shots/angles are constantly changing. If RNG is your ONLY choice, you are better off not playing. Take up stamp collecting.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 14, 2017, 03:36:25 AM
It is possible to play online RNG, win & cash out.  Is this common or easy?  No, but it can be.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 14, 2017, 07:47:36 AM
There are a lot of fake news in this thread.

In Germany there are about 90 sec. between every spin. No ten-sec-Rule.
With GUT you have all numbers to bet already prepared, no searching, no collecting, noc judging if a crossing appears.
GUT can be played everywhere, where numbers are randomly produced.
Mins and Maxs are no problem because GUT is flatbet.

Other arguments only tell that the fake-news-producer knows nothing about GUT.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: dobbelsteen on September 14, 2017, 08:58:48 AM
I play very often in my house  B&M casino. On the online casinos I do a lot practice. On most RNG roulette you can drive the game with the spin button. The live roulette  is normally without real players. The game time is not variable. Time for placing your bets is shorter than 18 seconds. This means that most systems or strategies are impossible. Pass over 3 spins and you become a warning. This are so called webkillers. You leave the casino and never come back.
I diver systems in beautiful and playable. Many systems are not playable within the 10 second rule of Mr.J.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 14, 2017, 01:40:46 PM
""Time for placing your bets is shorter than 18 seconds. This means that most systems or strategies are impossible. This are so called webkillers. You leave the casino and never come back.
I diver systems in beautiful and playable. Many systems are not playable within the 10 second rule of Mr.J.""
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PLAYABLE as you say, very smart point.

 ""This means that most systems or strategies are impossible"" >> 100% correct. As I said, once you eliminate.....
calculations, many numbers bet, many units bet, RNG, short spins, progressions, your connection being cut off, mins & max bets etc.etc.

At that point, the men are separated from the rest of the herd. Just because something looks neato on paper, means nothing in the REAL world at an ACTUAL casino.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 14, 2017, 03:33:24 PM
I don´t know where you play at.
But it seems you are disabled to look for a casino that gives you time enough to place your bets.
Here in Germany when a player is covering the whole carpet they just ask if they can start spinning now or does he need more time.

Even if MrJ is repeating his lies and fantasies about the time you need to play GUT and the amount of numbers you have to bet it will not become true. Not today not tommorrow and not in any future.

On the other hand in the other board he is terribly insulting Kav by name. Who or which forum needs such people?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: dobbelsteen on September 14, 2017, 04:02:01 PM
The customs in a B&M casino and an online casino are not the same. The number of spins per hour is more important for the online casino than the satisfaction of the player.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 14, 2017, 04:04:48 PM
The customs in a B&M casino and an online casino are not the same. The number of spins per hour is more important for the online casino than the satisfaction of the player.

But this is also no argument that GUT doesn´t work and isn´t playable at all.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 15, 2017, 01:33:52 AM
I don't see the number of spins per hour as being an issue at all.  Some of us make far more complex calculations in far less time.

The problem I see is with the crossing and defining when and what to bet.  When system testing the players are looking forwards and backwards in time to see which crossing appeared to work the best for them.  Unfortunately such unintentional time travel isn't allowed in the casino.  However, when the rules for the system are defined for the system in advance of betting, the system no longer works, as each crossing appears to show a loss after enough bets have been placed. 

It's the age old problem with "could of should of would of bet this or that."  It's common, it's unintentional, and many fall prey to it.  Some define it as the human element.  Unfortunately it's the "Achilles heal" for many system players.

Please note the word "unintentional" above. un·in·ten·tion·al

adjective

not done on purpose.
"the translation added a layer of unintentional comedy"
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 02:17:35 AM
 "unintentional time travel isn't allowed in the casino" >> ROFL
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 15, 2017, 02:19:51 AM
I'm trying very very hard to be nice. Really!
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 03:07:00 AM
In under ten seconds? Nope.

No way, to access "number crossing data" (per spin), then bet on all numbers..... at an ACTUAL casino.

No way, no how.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 15, 2017, 03:26:00 AM
Mr. J,

I guess will have to disagree on this one.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 15, 2017, 10:03:21 AM
I back that one "desagriement" even if it affects me emotionally... :( .
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 02:05:54 PM

I guess will have to disagree on this one.

Is it the "ten seconds" you dont agree with? I read most of GUT but in FAIRNESS, perhaps I am missing something? (anyone can chime in)

These numbers bet, can be or are different per spin? Are they the SAME spin after spin? I read there can be up to 18 numbers bet?

Question being....in under 10 seconds, are we analyzing what needs to be bet along with placing up to 18 numbers and are some of these numbers, different chips per number or all the same?

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 03:03:42 PM

... I read most of GUT but in FAIRNESS, perhaps I am missing something? (anyone can chime in)

Question being....in under 10 seconds, are we analyzing what needs to be bet along with placing up to 18 numbers and are some of these numbers, different chips per number or all the same?

Ken

You are missing nearly everything. I said always don´t bet more than 17 numbers. Why do you argue with 18 numbers?
Most time there are less then 10 numbers to bet.
Sometimes you know the numbers to bet before the next spin has started.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 03:18:57 PM
Ok, so UP TO 17 numbers, got it.

AND "sometimes" you know the numbers prior. If you dont know and NEED to analyze, can that all be done and chips placed in under ten seconds? Here is a clue that your system (anyone for that matter) probably does not work.

Does your dealer allow you to place everything down on time?? Yes? Then it doesn't work.

TRUE >> I have people here that will leave my table if I sit down. Why? Because they know the spins are gonna speed up.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 04:07:10 PM
I know the numbers to bet 2 spins before they are to bet. always. "Sometimes" was wrong.
I know every number and their group it belongs to at every point of the permanence.

and pls stop to argue with the 10 secs. Go and visit some other casinos and you will learn.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 15, 2017, 04:38:24 PM
Mr. J.,

My point is that vb players make more complex calculations and get a significant arc of numbers down in far less time without pen or paper.  So I can believe that he has plenty of time to bet.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 04:46:16 PM

and pls stop to argue with the 10 secs. 

I wont stop with the ten second point. They give "you" plenty of time for a reason sir. I bet if you wanted 45 seconds they would give it to you. There's a reason for that, think it through. Spend some time in an actual CASINO and you'll learn a thing or two.

Ken

 
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 04:54:04 PM

and pls stop to argue with the 10 secs. 

I wont stop with the ten second point. They give "you" plenty of time for a reason sir. I bet if you wanted 45 seconds they would give it to you. There's a reason for that, think it through. Spend some time in an actual CASINO and you'll learn a thing or two.

Ken

could you either pls decied if I have 10 or 45 seconds or stop this bet-time-dicussion it got nothing to do with GUT
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 05:22:34 PM
"stop this bet-time-dicussion"....another rookie. EVERY method is/should be centered around amount of time NEEDED to place bets. Let me ask you this Winkel and anyone can jump in.

When we create a method, we all have rules for it. BR needed etc. etc.

My question....do you create it with the goal/understanding of calculating which numbers and placing bets in under ten seconds? If no, why? Secondary question, if not ten, do you have ANY time frame for placing bets? If no, why?

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 05:31:11 PM
You are joking.

I answered these questions several times.
You are confused because you didn´t read the answers and only stucked in your short brained arguments.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 05:48:37 PM
Geeeeez

Winkel, nobody is arguing here. If its too hot in the kitchen, __________.

*SIMPLE* question....when you create ANY method, do you do so with a short time limit in mind, in order to place bets on time? If that is not even a thought in your head, I'm asking why not? I have a roulette table here at home. When I would create a method, I would TIME MYSELF in order to get all chips placed. I just assumed everyone did this.

Ken
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 05:57:28 PM
Ken

Now you are deniing that your are arguing. What are you doing then here? Just annoying?

If I´d create a strategy for EC then I´d have a timelimit to bet of 120 minutes.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 06:20:54 PM
I forgot: If I create a strategy for plein then I calculate with a betting-time of 2 Hrs
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 06:23:05 PM
Another question:

What has all this to do with the title:

Constructive reviews and explanation
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 15, 2017, 06:36:53 PM
Its just the way he approaches playing within a casino, which seems to work for him.  I think its instructional for all of us to know that pressure is being placed on croupiers to frustrate system players by spinning as quickly as possible.

Of course you have pointed out that this is not objectively true with all casinos and croupiers, which is also very useful to know! :D
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: mr j on September 15, 2017, 09:44:16 PM
I cannot imagine creating a system/method and not practicing *EVERYTHING* at home before entering a B&M casino.

"Practicing" includes, TIMING ONESELF in order to secure all chips in their proper spot in under ten seconds. How this is not talked about or acknowledged is odd to me, sorry. That type of conversation is foreign to me. Once again, I cannot RELATE (cough) to most (not all) of the posters.

Tackle this game 100%, not 90%.

Dont even get me started on how I experimented wearing adult diapers in order to cut down on bathroom breaks because I could miss something. I go 100% or nothing. If the dealer blinks his damn eyes four times before spinning...yep...I'll study that as well. 100% or nothing.

Ken

Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 15, 2017, 11:00:44 PM
you are so ignorant that it hurts.

Open any Online Casino with kive tables during hours of business.
When the latest spin is shown and betting is allowed stop time which is allowed to bet. Transfer this to real live conditions.
And then forget the 10 seconds.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: BlueAngel on September 15, 2017, 11:10:58 PM
In the real world of roulette, there is no "repeat bet" button.

Ken

That's 1 of the disadvantages when you bet at B&M casinos.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: BlueAngel on September 15, 2017, 11:40:40 PM

It's 100% sure that will cross BUT if you don't know WHEN the crossing will happen it cannot provide you any advantage.

This is the bottom line, can you understand it?

Let me put it another way, instead of crossings let's say I'm betting Red which includes 18 numbers and I rightfully declare that:
"Have to come, it will come and it does come..."
Would I be wrong by saying so? NO
Would this realization be sufficient to become long term winner? NO

So this crossing of 18 'red' numbers lost when I bet it, but it happened 3 spins later when I was betting another crossing of 12 numbers (dozen or column) in order to recover from the 1st lost crossing...

The same I could say for any possible total of numbers, it's like you are expecting the un-hit numbers to hit when you bet them, it's just another way to bet what's due.

Everything comes eventually but will it be 1 spin later or ...(put number of spins here) spins later nobody can declare it with 100% certainty.

Sorry Jannus but your GUT is not HG, not even a semi grail, as a matter of fact is as good as random betting.
I don't understand why thousands of people around the web/globe put so much faith in such things!  :o ::)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 12:11:39 AM

It's 100% sure that will cross BUT if you don't know WHEN the crossing will happen it cannot provide you any advantage.

This is the bottom line, can you understand it?


GUT tells you exactly when a crossing is to happen or not to happen.
This is the bottom line can you understand it?

And therefore all your blablabla is senseless and useless
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: BlueAngel on September 16, 2017, 12:18:28 AM
Perhaps the rules are deterministic according to you and vague according others...the question remains, does it win better than average expectation?
I think not, besides why should it be?
Why is better than betting exactly the opposite?

Come on Janus, you should know better than that by now.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Scarface on September 16, 2017, 01:10:45 AM
My local casino allows repeat bet via touchscreen, but uses a live wheel.  So I could play this system.  So, what's the verdict?  Does GUT work?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 16, 2017, 01:33:48 AM
Of cause it works, but not always, and not often enough to use it as a money maker.
    I can tell you what really works..  it's same as in any other thing - study till you UNDERSTAND yourself . Hard work pays off.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 16, 2017, 01:34:46 AM
  Does GUT work?

No.  Of course it doesn't.  It's no better than random guessing.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 16, 2017, 01:46:34 AM
Although "Does GUT work?" seems like a simple and valid question, things are actually much more complicated than this.
Does marriage work? Does robbing a bank work? Do Audis crash? Are lawyers making a ton of money?
Seemingly simple questions that can not be seriously answered before we define clearly what we are asking for.

Read more here:
The risk and reward of a “winning system” (https://www.roulette30.com/p/is-it-possible-to-beat-roulette.html)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 16, 2017, 07:34:12 AM
GUT tells you exactly when a crossing is to happen or not to happen.
And therefore all your blablabla is senseless and useless
So main is that it nothing show - especially -
Quote
exactly when
If it will show, that means, that about half numbers in concrete spin cant fall. So say why they cant fall, which is that force which protect these number places from coming ball in to them ???

If your GUT works it must work for all player and sugest what to do for all players the same.
But it  even sugest different for player who start write numbers earlier, than for player, who start the same do later !!!
You understand that this is nonsence ? Working system must gave the same sugesttion no matter you saw previous spins or not - they passed and to future have no influence - here is not miracle world....
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: dobbelsteen on September 16, 2017, 07:59:52 AM
I have googled on internet for an explanation of GUt. I could not found such system. Which tools do I have to play Gut.Do I have to note the numbers and convert them in random sequences of other chances. Do I have to wait for particular oppertunities?
Janusz tell me exact what you have to do in 15 seconds for your bet.

in the past I have demonstrate my manner of playing. Without noting the numbers, I played about a hour and played about 150 spins. The profit were about 100 units.   
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 16, 2017, 09:11:58 AM
There are over 80 pages in the thread on vlsroulette.com and the system as explained in the first post seems simple enough. I've haven't read all 80 pages. It's clear when you should make bets, but what isn't so clear is why the system should win. It basically boils down to making a guess about which numbers will appear or not appear.

Kav posted a link to a basic explanation of the system. https://www.roulette-bet.com/2017/01/great-universal-theory-gut-system-by.html (https://www.roulette-bet.com/2017/01/great-universal-theory-gut-system-by.html)

If you're guessing then at least it should be an educated guess. Maybe Janusz could suggest why you should make one choice rather than another.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 09:15:46 AM
Perhaps the rules are deterministic according to you and vague according others...the question remains, does it win better than average expectation?
It wins. To say it wins better I had to know all other systems.

I think not, besides why should it be?
Why is better than betting exactly the opposite?
Come on Janus, you should know better than that by now.

Why should it not be?
If you should bet the opposite GUT would show you.
I know it better than the haters here.

There is still no argument against GUT. Only the old empty phrases.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 09:18:29 AM
  Does GUT work?

No.  Of course it doesn't.  It's no better than random guessing.

You, the one that disturbed and ruined the threads about GUT from the first day on, you are only afraid, that you are wrong. You are not open minded. You are [something else instead].
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 09:28:52 AM
Bebediktus,

If it will show, that means, that about half numbers in concrete spin cant fall

How can I discus with people who are not serious?
I didn´t say, that they can´t fall (nobody can). It just means that in this special moment a crossing can happen because the difference is <2. That is a educated gues with special probability to happen. Because the lines cross in every permanence there are lines that cross. That is proven and that is truth.

If your GUT works it must work for all player and sugest what to do for all players the same.
It doesn´t work for players who are not understanding or narrowminded. You have to have the personal ability to win with it.

But it  even sugest different for player who start write numbers earlier, than for player, who start the same do later !!!

That shows that you don´t understand roulette at all. Spin 1 to 50 is a complete other sequence than spin 2 to 51. If you still don´t know study roulette first.

Your words are nonsense but also not a miracle.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Scarface on September 16, 2017, 09:48:50 AM
From what I'm seeing here, it seems like GUT doesn't work in the sense that it gives us a mathematical edge.  I admit I do not know all the rules to know when to play what crossings and when...if the rules were clearly defined, them it should be relatively easy for programmers to test.  I like playing hot numbers, and repeats, but this seems like alot of tracking for something that has no better results than random
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 10:08:11 AM
From what I'm seeing here, it seems like GUT doesn't work in the sense that it gives us a mathematical edge.

Do you know that in a game of random with negative expectation there is NO mathematical edge?

Study to learn this basic roulette phenomenon.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 16, 2017, 12:09:24 PM
That shows that you don´t understand roulette at all. Spin 1 to 50 is a complete other sequence than spin 2 to 51. If you still don´t know study roulette first.

All difference is spin 1 and spin 51  :) .
Now if you say that i not understand roulette at all means, that you understand it perfect, then we can very easy to see, how your perfect  understanding helps in winings.
I offer you show your abilities on public - so predict on video translattion.
We that can do in two way
1  We conect to the same online casino and you predict numbers

2 Possible to do video then cut ends of every spin and you the same predict....

After we bouth calculate how much your predicttions are better, than random predicttions.
If your predictions are better, than random, by 3 STD that will show that your system really works and  I give up and for all publick will say, that me are that who absolutely nothing understand in roulette.

But if not ,  especially if your predicttions will give result to minus you must to make something that for all others will be clear, that system is not worth any cent.....

Because you are such professional, you can easy show big advantage and with that, show, that your system works..... and all your oponents are not right   :)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 12:14:06 PM
AP-players are very funny people.

If I claim I tested my strategy winning they claim: You didn´t play enough spins!

But If I loose in one short test they want me to claim: My strategy is not winning!

You are a bit crazy, aren´t you?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 16, 2017, 12:39:16 PM
Man , if system is wining it must have advantage against casino. To have advantage we must have some reason, why ball cant enter in concrete spin to concrete number (-s).
All that is very simple and clear.

When I play i often know which will be number on the wheel, when ball will fall. Then ball will scater and will stop in some place. It cant scater infinity numbers - that means that we can calculate how often, which durattion of scatering it will have. And i can play on such distances, which overcome house edge.

Very simple and very clear - If I that can calculate - i have advantage and i win. If i cant that calculate - mine play is random....The same is with you - to win is only way - you must know which number will fall - better than random....

So simple you get questtion, but not gave answer - what let you get advantage ? Answer to this questtion and nobody more will disturb you ... :)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 16, 2017, 12:42:20 PM
Janusz, Bb is very strong player. If you find its funny that he says... it's just puts yourself on very negative position and here is why:
 1. He never ever bothered to tolk bs on publick forums
 2. Whatever he says can be traced to roulette reality , conceptualised and used in real play.
    Why wouldn't you agree on demo? After all you are the one who says it works, so prove it. I offer myself to make sure test is not affected in any way.
   So what you say, are we still funny people?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 16, 2017, 12:48:05 PM
Man , if system is wining it must have advantage against casino. To have advantage we must have some reason, why ball cant enter in concrete spin to concrete number (-s).

This is the crux of the matter as far as I'm concerned. There seem to be no end to the number of roulette systems but it seems very rare for anyone to explain *why* their system should work. That goes for GUT too, unless Janusz can give us a reason? When a 'crossing' is due, why should we bet one way over another?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 12:51:54 PM
Quote
if system is wining it must have advantage against casino.

No! I don´t bet against the casino. I don´t change odds. I´m playing following the probability!
Scattering balls don´t affect my predictions!

I don´t know which number will fall. I presume that one number out of a group of numbers will fall.

What gives me an advantage? It is simple: The theories by Kolmogoroff and Markov.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 16, 2017, 05:56:43 PM
Turbulence or turbulent flow is a flow regime in fluid dynamics characterized by chaotic changes in pressure and flow velocity. It is in contrast to a laminar flow regime, which occurs when a fluid flows in parallel layers, with no disruption between those layers.[1]

Turbulence is commonly observed in everyday phenomena such as surf, fast flowing rivers, billowing storm clouds, or smoke from a chimney, and most fluid flows occurring in nature and created in engineering applications are turbulent.[2][3]:2 Turbulence is caused by excessive kinetic energy in parts of a fluid flow, which overcomes the damping effect of the fluid's viscosity. For this reason turbulence is easier to create in low viscosity fluids, but more difficult in highly viscous fluids. In general terms, in turbulent flow, unsteady vortices appear of many sizes which interact with each other, consequently drag due to friction effects increases. This would increase the energy needed to pump fluid through a pipe, for instance. However this effect can also be exploited by such as aerodynamic spoilers on aircraft, which deliberately "spoil" the laminar flow to increase drag and reduce lift.

The onset of turbulence can be predicted by a dimensionless constant called the Reynolds number, which calculates the balance between kinetic energy and viscous damping in a fluid flow. However, turbulence has long resisted detailed physical analysis, and the interactions within turbulence creates a very complex situation. Richard Feynman has described turbulence as the most important unsolved problem of classical physics.[4]







In probability theory and related fields, a Markov process, named after the Russian mathematician Andrey Markov, is a stochastic process that satisfies the Markov property[1][2] (sometimes characterized as "memorylessness"). Roughly speaking, a process satisfies the Markov property if one can make predictions for the future of the process based solely on its present state just as well as one could knowing the process's full history, hence independently from such history; i.e., conditional on the present state of the system, its future and past states are independent.

A Markov chain is a type of Markov process that has either discrete state space or discrete index set (often representing time), but the precise definition of a Markov chain varies.[3] For example, it is common to define a Markov chain as a Markov process in either discrete or continuous time with a countable state space (thus regardless of the nature of time),[4][5][6][7] but it is also common to define a Markov chain as having discrete time in either countable or continuous state space (thus regardless of the state space).[3]

Markov studied Markov processes in the early 20th century, publishing his first paper on the topic in 1906, but earlier uses of Markov processes already existed.[8][9][10] Random walks on the integers and the Gambler's ruin problem are examples of Markov processes[11][12] and were studied hundreds of years earlier.[13][14] Two important examples of Markov processes are the Wiener process, also known as the Brownian motion process, and the Poisson process,[15] which are considered the most important and central stochastic processes in the theory of stochastic processes,[16][17][18] and were discovered repeatedly and independently, both before and after 1906, in various settings.[19][20] These two processes are Markov processes in continuous time, while random walks on the integers and the Gambler's ruin problem are examples of Markov processes in discrete time.[11][12]


Markov chains have many applications as statistical models of real-world processes,[21][22][23] such as studying cruise control systems in motor vehicles, queues or lines of customers arriving at an airport, exchange rates of currencies, storage systems such as dams, and population growths of certain animal species.[24] The algorithm known as PageRank, which was originally proposed for the internet search engine Google, is based on a Markov process.[25][26] Furthermore, Markov processes are the basis for general stochastic simulation methods known as Gibbs sampling and Markov Chain Monte Carlo, are used for simulating random objects with specific probability distributions, and have found extensive application in Bayesian statistics.[24][27][28]
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 06:19:34 PM
Thank you Reyth,

one main Sentence is: the result of an probable event at time code n has nothing to do with the result at time code n-1 and will have nothing to do with the future event at time code n+1

But  between
n-1 <=> n <=> n+1 there is a hidden sequence (Hidden Markov Sequence HMS)
This sequence is unknown but can be presume as similiar!

This is how GUT works and can be proofed with

Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 16, 2017, 08:06:28 PM

What gives me an advantage? It is simple: The theories by Kolmogoroff and Markov.
Theory cant give you advantage at all.... Advantage can give only one thing- you know that some number(-s) now will not hit. If you have such knowledges - you have advantage, not have - pitty but advantage you not have.

And at all - all that are empty talks - we can solve all much simplier. You are German  and are in Germany at least one AP -  Kristian Kaisan .
Meet him and prove to him , if he will say that you have advantage i will believe....
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 16, 2017, 08:17:06 PM
Do I have to explain, that obviously not the theory gives me the advantage but the application of the theory.

you are arguing like babys.

Why do I have to ask Christian? He doesn´t believe in anything but his VB. He himself said that he is waiting for a simple system based on physics. Nothing else he is interested in.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 16, 2017, 09:54:05 PM
Janusz,

Bebediktus is actually a professional player.  As such he handily knows what works, and what doesn't.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 17, 2017, 07:52:40 AM
Janusz,

Bebediktus is actually a professional player.  As such he handily knows what works, and what doesn't.

I am a professional player. As such I handily know what works, and what doesn´t.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 17, 2017, 09:19:51 AM
Thank you Reyth,

one main Sentence is: the result of an probable event at time code n has nothing to do with the result at time code n-1 and will have nothing to do with the future event at time code n+1

But  between
n-1 <=> n <=> n+1 there is a hidden sequence (Hidden Markov Sequence HMS)
This sequence is unknown but can be presume as similiar!

This is how GUT works and can be proofed with
Bro! Really??? Markov  should be rouling on his grave from abuse you made of his theory.  It was designed for stochastic process,  not deterministic one. Roulette is deterministic!!!
   Any bias in roulette will violate requirements for aplication of his chains. I have never seen wheel , wich is not biased to some degree.  NEVER!!! DAMN EVER!!!!
      And what about kolmogorov theorium?  How would you use in roulette??? Could you please populate?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 17, 2017, 09:32:13 AM
Stochastic: giving a result that cannot be guessed, being caused by chance

Deterministic: using or believing in the idea that everything is caused by another event or action and so you are not free to choose what you do

O_o

Pretty bold claim.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 17, 2017, 10:10:29 AM
Reyth, nice to provide the definitions so everyone understands what we are talking about.

It is all about predictability. No matter the cause, if the outcome is unpredictable (random) then knowing there is a cause is irrelevant. Not all deterministic phenomena are predictable.
There are true Random Number Generators created by programmers.
Just because the ball is spun by a hand and follows the laws of physics, doesn't mean it is predictable.

The best example of randomness of a deterministic process is weather. We live in the space age, we have super computers. we have laws that explain thermodynamics, gravity, the movement of the earth, the atmosphere around the earth. Yet weather is still an unpredictable deterministic phenomenon (long term). Ask any meteorologist what the weather will be in your town one year from now and his guess is as good as yours.

The point is that no matter if a phenomenon is deterministic, it can still be unpredictable/random.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: dobbelsteen on September 17, 2017, 11:49:06 AM
Markov lived in the time there were no computers. Simulation of ideas were not possible.

The roulette have an edge. Neither roulette strategies and systems nor players have an edge. Ask a player what is his edge ,you become a waterfall of words but no definition.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 17, 2017, 12:49:36 PM
 I can give you numbers for roulettes l already recearched including many of famous online wheels. It will be in some +/- category,  but it will be still a numbers, no words. 
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 17, 2017, 04:49:40 PM
Quote
I am a professional player. As such I handily know what works, and what doesn´t.-Winkel

Sorry, but not a chance.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 17, 2017, 08:55:05 PM
Please stop quoting previous posts (https://www.roulettelife.com/index.php?topic=1434.0)

It is only that kind of argumentation and discussion you know and understand.
Why should I believe you if you don´t believe me?

You are just a man hunter. Nothing else. No human, no character, no faith, nothing what could make a human.

[admin: please avoid personal attacks]
Title: G.U.T. Advanced Game - Session
Post by: LiveRouletteOnlinePlayer on September 18, 2017, 12:57:26 AM
There is video youtube, some person playing gut tracker clicker which done excel. Yes he wins but is gut consistent method or win here and there i don't like methods where you bet like many numbers together if you lose many time you need re-bet so much pay your losses and win also
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 18, 2017, 02:06:57 AM
This video is by the person who stole Winkel's system and sells it as e-book.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 18, 2017, 03:31:47 AM
Quote
You are just a man hunter. Nothing else. No human, no character, no faith, nothing what could make a human.

Wow Janusz,

If I said such things about you, which I never would, I'd be roasted.  In the thread you'll notice that I don't attack the messenger, I just criticize the system itself, and I even tried to explain how it's easy for everyone to be fooled when testing some systems...(you know I've been down that road before as well...it can happen.)  I'm trying to be nice in the thread.  Perhaps you could try the same?  Rather than attacking others or me, try explaining why our statements are possibly mathematically wrong or flawed.   Try providing examples.  It's ok to attack the message, just try and go easier on the messenger.

In the meantime I will pull back from this thread for a while.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 18, 2017, 03:42:41 AM
I will say that I have recognized a certain human side to Real and I am always happy when he chooses to act so.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 18, 2017, 10:03:39 AM
I'm still waiting for reply from Winkel,  how to use Kolmogorov''s theories in roulette.
    Please, stop to tiese me, lm curios... :).
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: thomasleor on September 18, 2017, 10:24:44 AM


MrP; Are you referring to his general inertia-range theory, where the inertia-range cascade in a system is described from a view point of fundamental statistical mechanics, or merely his mathematical presentation of inertial-range velocity-difference moments in cascades of kinetic energy from large scales, to small scales of motion in incurred turbulence?

Personally I doubt there is even a remote possibility of measuring the energy dissipation per unit mass e in a kinetic object, like a roulette ball, without some kind of highly sensitive instrument (and small enough to hide it from the casino personell).

The latter would , if possible, constitute cheating which again falls back on its user because of any discovery would instantly lead to his or hers name getting on the ECA (European Casino Association) black list, which means no more casino visits - for life. Period.

If you did the same thing in for example, Macau, the Chinese casino owners would take you outside the Casino, shoot you and dump you somewhere in the Chinese Sea, I don´t know how our redneck friends over seas in dear ol´USA would handle such things but they would most probably, if it concerned considerable sums,  depending on which hick-state we speak of, apply something similar, or if it concerned smaller sums, enjoy themselves a bit before law enforcement arrived and brought you with them to a nice cell.

The mere fact that large corporations owns most Casinos in Las Vegas and Atlantic City these days,  wouldn´t necessary prohibit said probability,  as greed, and the loss of what is most coveted, money,  always brings out the worst in any type of people, even those in fine suits and nice titles.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 18, 2017, 12:08:34 PM
I'm regfering to the post of Winkel where he states that kolmogorov works and Markov's give him edge for GUT to work. Markov chains l dissmissed as not upplicable myself, but what about kolmogorov..  ????
   Same as you , lm curios.
 
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 18, 2017, 12:28:46 PM
It is very simple:

As I stated in my reply to the test of KonFuSed:

If I have a crossing e.g. 14 13 10 then Kolmogorof proved, that all groups have the Probability of 1 to give a result of the random experiment.

Each Group of them therefore give the probability of 14/100 and 13/100 and 10/100 or in Roulette where we have 37 possbile outcames:
14/37 and 13/37 and 10/37

This is also the reason why KonFuSed proved each Crossing as losing (due to houseedge)
If this wouldn´t be I had no hope that the group of 14/37 (which is to cross the 13) would ever win or win often enough.

But: In a permanence (or as I named it: trot) there is not only 1 crossing. There are mostly more crossings.
And not all the appearing crossings are bound to lose.
If I lose 14 twice and win a 3vs2 crossing I´m in plus
If I lose 14 twice and win the 13 and the 8 crossing I´m in Plus.

also the trot gives information when to bet and not to bet.
If there had been 5 F0 hiting back to back creating now a crossing, I wouldn´t bet.
If two crossings are lost, I would jump. and I can read where to jump to find crossing crossings.

So I can avoid the losing crossings and concentrate on the winning.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: MrPerfect. on September 18, 2017, 12:57:23 PM
Janusz, lm lost and still do not understand how kolmogorov''s things do upply to your GUTS system. You use too much specific to yourself terms that mean nothing to me personally,  and l belive it is so for many people trying to read the tread.
    Could you by any chance in simple terms explain what is it all about and how it works? So even most notexpirienced reader could understand???
   
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: thomasleor on September 18, 2017, 01:24:03 PM

So far, I have not seen anything he has mentioned as proof of concept,  that works and produces as per his own claims, a consistent profit making system (GUT) that is nothing more than a static system. The very act of even claiming that the very advanced theorem of Kolmogorov, not forgetting such a claim instantly involves the Navier-Stoke equations that supports very much Kolmogorov´s theorem,  is ludicrous.

Remember that he basically claims that all this is applied to his simple static system of  a supposed numerical prediction that achieves to predict and keep up with an extremely dynamic number generator as a roulette wheel, not to mention being ahead of the  infinite variance curve generated by said generator...please

[Admin: Please avoid personal remarks]
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 18, 2017, 01:27:59 PM
If I lose 14 twice and win a 3vs2 crossing I´m in plus
If I lose 14 twice and win the 13 and the 8 crossing I´m in Plus.
On wheel are no crossings - are simply numbers, so this way you must talk are 14 numbers which i not saw in falling, are 13 numbers which i saw exact once and are 10 number which saw twice or more. From this point you must explain . what you bet and when you will be in plus...
This way is easy to see if other bet is worse or not....
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 18, 2017, 02:17:27 PM
I don't know if it is the same these days but I have heard a story about a man who used a slots device being warned to never come back.  He came back and they took him out into the desert and beat him severely.  I have heard a rumour that the mob is no longer affiliated with the casinos but I have no idea what to believe.

I know the US Courts do frown upon cheating in casinos.
 
This is twice that Jan has provided an explanation as to why KonFu's test was incomplete; it is quite clear that his system has more elements than just the N1 crossing.

You guys don't believe in pure RNG, we all get that but stating your opinion that it can't be true because you don't believe in it, is just not helping -- we know you don't believe in it already.

There are practical limits to RNG, so it is POSSIBLE to use a pure RNG system to achieve these limits, even if you haven't done so or don't believe its possible.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 18, 2017, 02:31:41 PM
On wheel are no crossings - are simply numbers,

that´s completely new to me. Can you explain?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 18, 2017, 02:48:34 PM
Do you see, that you do all - only that not say this way - " I bet - these and these numbers".  :)

And reason, why you behave so - is very simple - you himself understand, that such system cant work....it simply not have background .
And you can thousand years talk that it works - what will be better for you ? Only, that you have subject to talk....but benefit are - zero....
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 18, 2017, 03:19:35 PM
GUT is "universal" it doesn´t need to knwo which the numbers are. it is enough that there are 14 in the first group and 13 in the second group. If you want numbers put 1 to 14 in one group and 15 to 27 in the second group. But don´t forget to put 10 in a third group.

I behave so, because you distract me with phrases like "there are no crossings in the wheel". Do you want to discuss with niveau? Pls write with niveau!
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 18, 2017, 03:27:55 PM
What is niveau and which is his relationship to our talk ?
Quote
If you want numbers put 1 to 14 in one group and 15 to 27 in the second group. But don´t forget to put 10 in a third group.
For me is not important which are numbers - you simply divide all numbers to three groups  wit 14 ,13 and 10 numbers . Which group you bet ?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 18, 2017, 03:43:40 PM
The 14 numbers-group because they show a crossing with the 13 numbers-group. but is is so basic.
How can someone tell that GUT doesn´t work even he doesn´t know how GUT works?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 18, 2017, 03:56:27 PM
This video is by the person who stole Winkel's system and sells it as e-book.

Are we talking about the same system which was described on vlsroulette .com or something else? If it's the same system (GUT) then how can it be stolen if it was published freely on a discussion forum?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 18, 2017, 04:20:14 PM
The fact that it was posted on a public forum doesn't change the fact that it is Winkel's intellectual property.
How would you call selling something that is not yours and was shared freely by the creator?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 18, 2017, 04:30:10 PM
It's not unique, and it's pretty much recycled law of the third stuff/binomial distribution.  Look back further and you'll find it's very similar to the other stuff.

Here's some stuff from 2002..http://www.gamblersglen.com/cgi-bin/teemz/teemz.cgi?board=_master&action=opentopic&topic=75&forum=Roulette_Archive

http://www.gamblersglen.com/cgi-bin/teemz/teemz.cgi?board=_master&action=opentopic&topic=2041&forum=Roulette_Archive
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: thomasleor on September 18, 2017, 04:35:07 PM


That is correct. Unfortunately there is little respect for the law these days and even less than that, intellectual property. If the person who stole Winkel´s IP is residing in Europe, mr Winkel could sue and would most probably win a very fast and easy trial, in Brussels, or in an affiliate representative court at home. An impound of assets, like salary or bank assets would then be executed through a local Senior enforcement officer.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 18, 2017, 04:36:51 PM
Nothing would happen.  There's no case there.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 18, 2017, 04:38:13 PM
Quote
How would you call selling something that is not yours and was shared freely by the creator?

Looking at the website it's obvious he isn't trying to pass the system off as his creation so I don't think there's an issue of copywrite or stealing intellectual property. It seems that a lot of folks have had trouble understanding the system as originally presented so this guy has taken advantage of that. I say good luck to him. Creators of good ideas aren't necessarily the best at explaining or making the most of them. I would have thought Janusz would be flattered but instead he seems indignant, oh well.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 18, 2017, 04:41:49 PM
If I pirate the songs of Rihanna it does not mean I pretend to be Rihanna. Copyright has nothing to do with disclosing or not it is not your work.
(https://static01.nyt.com/images/2015/10/25/t-magazine/25tmag-11well_rihanna-t_CA0/25tmag-11well_rihanna-t_CA0-articleLarge-v2.jpg)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 18, 2017, 04:43:40 PM
The guy that created the website is at a greater risk of being sued by people that lose money playing the system that he's posted.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 18, 2017, 04:47:16 PM
Yes, imagine that scenario. And then trying to convince the court he had nothing to do with it. He was just explaining it better. lol
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 18, 2017, 04:50:30 PM
The guy (not Winkel) is clearly trying to make money from it.  He's set up an entire website.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: thomasleor on September 18, 2017, 04:56:28 PM
“Men are so simple of mind, and so much dominated by their immediate needs, that a deceitful man will always find plenty who are ready to be deceived. - Niccolò Machiavelli

Who belong to this former category...hmm let me see?

Politicians (especially senators and Presidents)
Lawyers,
Used car sellers,
Cigarette producers,
 and a long list , far too long to mention here..

and...oh..

Roulette system sellers :)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: McCoy on September 18, 2017, 05:42:56 PM
If I pirate the songs of Rihanna it does not mean I pretend to be Rihanna. Copyright has nothing to do with disclosing or not it is not your work.

Just to be clear I'm not trying to defend the guy but this comparison isn't very convincing. If I decide to write a manual telling you how to use some gizmo which I didn't design it doesn't make me a crook. Besides, you can't copyright a gambling system.

What is not protected by copyright?


1. Ideas, Methods, or Systems
Ideas, methods, and systems are not covered by copyright protection. According to the US Copyright Office, Circular 2, this covers quite a few things including making, or building things; scientific or technical methods or discoveries; business operations or procedures; mathematical principles; formulas, algorithms; or any other concept, process, or method of operation.

https://www.legalzoom.com/articles/5-things-you-cant-copyright (https://www.legalzoom.com/articles/5-things-you-cant-copyright)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: thomasleor on September 18, 2017, 06:00:14 PM


Sorry, McCoy, that is not entirely true.

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7818632.html (http://www.freepatentsonline.com/7818632.html)


Patent law is extremely complex, not only in USA but also in the EU.

Copyright of specific patterns, algos and similar expressions of mind can be patented, though the process is lengthy.

Here is what someone has to say in the matter:


In the US, a pure algorithm is explicitly exempted from being patentable as are mathematical facts and formulas and "ideas".
In reality, you can patent an algorithm (in the US). In fact, it doesn't even have to be in code and anyway when a patent is issued, it is NOT issued against source code, it's issued for "a series of steps performed" which of course is nothing more or less than an algorithm. Certainly working source code is not required, so the embodiment of the algorithm in code is not what's being patented. What's being patented is just the ethereal "idea" of something doing X then Y then Z in that order.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 18, 2017, 06:34:53 PM
Please stop quoting previous posts (https://www.roulettelife.com/index.php?topic=1434.0)

these both links have absolutely nothing to do with GUT.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Real on September 18, 2017, 06:50:10 PM
Quote
What is not protected by copyright?

1. Ideas, Methods, or Systems

McCoy is correct.  Gambling systems can not be patented.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: kav on September 18, 2017, 07:49:07 PM
Has anyone ever heard of Digital Millennium Copyright Act or DMCA?
Even a page on the web has copyright.
Some argue if you do a COMPLETE REWRITE of an idea, it may be free of copyright, but even plagiarism can be pursued legally.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 19, 2017, 04:18:35 AM
The 14 numbers-group because they show a crossing with the 13 numbers-group. but is is so basic.
How can someone tell that GUT don´t work even he doesn´t know how GUT works?
Ok now you stand just before dealer spin and placed bets on 14 number group. That your method will be wining - that 14 numbers group must have positive expectation to hit so probability to hit must be bigger than 14/37 ?

Now imagine, that all of these 14 numbers are more narrow - say by 5% - and that is reason , why they not hitted in past and when you bet on them - you have adittional 5% or more disadvantage !!!!
You measured that before bet, or somehow visually observed, if here are  something or not ?
For sure no !!

And talking - i bet because it will be crossing with group 13 - is only words , - that not create any advantage.
What will be if will hit number 13 and situattion becomes 14-12-11 ??? You will bet on 12 ?? But that 12 have almoust all numbers from that previous group of 13. Why spin before you detected it as bad group and after spin - detect as good ? Such changes not exsist . Usually if numbers are good and have advantage - that advantage not disaper after one spin !!!

Simply think about that.
For me is the same - you can cry that your system works , for mine play that have no influence....
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 19, 2017, 04:44:35 AM
His method doesn't just depend on that one bet, just sayin'.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 19, 2017, 05:20:09 AM
What difference one bet or many ? If are many, but negative bets - positive result you still not get....
And remember guys - for me is without difference, what you talk and what you play ( if play ).
Only i know , that with such talks some want to cheat others.

If somebody say, that hen put golden eggs - you also believe ? So why you believe that his system are "golden" ...

Why then he not play and make money, but spent time here ?

AP needs much forces and needs to be corrected every time , so not so easy to play, but "golden system ".....
If i will have such - 100% i will not spent here time and not talk about it for all , and the same will do everybody...  :)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 19, 2017, 05:28:09 AM
There is apparently a chain of bets where the statistics become more and more favorable and there is something else about his recovery method using those same statistics; its not just a simple bet with only that one dimension, apparently the whole thing is interrelated.

I haven't heard anyone talking about his entire system.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 19, 2017, 05:33:58 AM
Better not believe in fairy tales, but believe in facts - much more profitable :)
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 19, 2017, 12:05:38 PM
To believe in facts you have to know the facts.

An one thing is for sure: you do know nothing about the facts of GUT.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 19, 2017, 12:49:38 PM
No, you must say other - i know at least one fact about - that you bet in situation 14-13-10 on 14 numbers and believe that it is positive bet - that is main your mistake. That bet have the same -2.7%.....

Mathematic is simply - you bet 14 units and if win get 36 , but chance to hit have 14/37.
That your bet will be possitive chance to hit must be minimal 15/37.
So if you claim that your system positive , must prove that bet on 14 numbers in your case have expectattion 15/37 or more....
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 19, 2017, 01:15:36 PM
Absolutely not.

All possbile crossings have their negative expectation.

What you don´t understand: There are always more and several crossings.
All with negative expectation. But that doesn´t mean they lose every time I bet them. At least the have to win due to their winrate: 14/37 8/37 or any other value.

And it is not true, that all crossings will lose every time. so it is possible to win more than to lose in a session.
Gamblers intelligence shall detect and separate winning streaks from losing streaks.

I explained it very often, but all AP-Fans didn´t read it nor understand it.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 19, 2017, 03:48:11 PM
Quote
What you don´t understand: There are always more and several crossings.
All with negative expectation. But that doesn´t mean they lose every time I bet them.
Of course not every time , if  I will bet some number  i  also will win  in averidge 1 time from 37 , but that not do such play winner.

But essence is not when your bets win or loss , but which result they give in distance.
If you have only black bricks - you cant build white wall. If all your bets are - negative - you cant end in plus after long distance. Of course we can win in lottery , but talk is about wining scientifically. And that means that you play better than others and do something more, than what expect from you casino.

If will do like all others - you never will be winner....to read rules of system and follow them can  any, but do something more what others not able - far not every and exactly that, do from player - winner...
 
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on September 19, 2017, 04:16:53 PM
It is senseless. Just one of your arguments is destroyed you go back to the start: There is no winning system.

As you don´t see: my bricks are lack and white to a certain dimension. If I lay them right I will get a white wall.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on September 19, 2017, 08:01:54 PM
The GF is just a theory, it doesn't prove anything; its just the opinion of people who wish to apply it towards roulette.

As we all know its not the negative expectation that kills us but the negative variance.

People just use the GF to bolster their own argument with something that sounds good.

Just because people that are experts in math, believe its an absolute truth regarding roulette, doesn't make them experts in roulette but just experts in math who are stating their personal theory.  The GF itself cannot be proven, experts in math actually admit this.

So using this to say "see this is why your system cannot work" is great and everything but it is only a theory that cannot be proven and thus a personal opinion.
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Bebediktus on September 19, 2017, 08:08:40 PM
Quote
As we all know its not the negative expectation that kills us but the negative variance.
Where you was, when  others in school learned probabilities  :) ?
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Janusz on October 15, 2017, 01:06:51 PM
No more constructive reviews and arguments left?

Then I consider GUT is working!
Title: Re: Constructive reviews and explanation as to why the GUT doesn't work.
Post by: Reyth on October 15, 2017, 04:14:11 PM
LOL.