Author Topic: Optimum amount of numbers to play.  (Read 1147 times)

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MickyP

Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« on: January 18, 2018, 10:45:52 AM »
It has been observed and stated that players start off playing many numbers per spin and this gradually reduces to only playing a few numbers. If you think about this it seems like the logical way a players approach to winning develops,

When you lose playing many numbers you lose a lot in one go and you have to win so much more just to recoup that one loss. Losing on a 30 number bet will set you back by 5 wins to recoup that loss. If you play a 5 number bet you have 7 opportunities to win or break even.

Bet selection is obviously crucial to any game play and different methods require a different amount of numbers for them to be effective. The question here is; are methods that require few numbers better than those that require many number?

I know this question has a very wide interpretation so maybe we could narrow this down a little. What is the optimum amount of numbers to base a method on and why?

Please consider the fact that players may learn something from your answers.
 
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MrPerfect.

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #1 on: January 18, 2018, 01:21:48 PM »
There is cost of mistakes attached plus variance from betting too few numbers.  Somehow optimal for average cases is 7.
   However anything can be on particular wheel.
       There are cases when betting less numbers is better, there are others where betting more numbers is required.
    Data and proper simulator of bets will help to determine what is work better for a particular case.
 
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Mike

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #2 on: January 18, 2018, 02:53:46 PM »
I concur with Mr P in that 7 seems to be about the optimum, at least in my experience (1 on the target + 3 either side). It's generally a BAD idea to bet too many numbers because the house edge has an increasing effect the more numbers you play. More than 10 is too many.
 
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kav

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #3 on: January 18, 2018, 03:04:37 PM »
Like I have stated in many instances before, every part of a strategy works in conjunction with every other part of a specific strategy.

For example I have found out that:
Betting many numbers, betting on cold numbers and increasing when you loose, work well together.
Also
Betting few numbers, betting on hot numbers and increasing when you win, work well together.
Everything can work if it fits as a part of a specific greater strategy.
https://www.roulettelife.com/index.php?topic=1771.msg25123#msg25123
 

MickyP

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2018, 03:19:34 PM »
Great answers and sound advice from MrPerfect, Mike and Kav.

Mike, you say not more than ten numbers. This puts playing a dozen just out of reach. Will you give a short explanation why more than ten numbers is not advisable? (House edge = too many numbers and variance = too few numbers)
Your answer creates a boundary of ten and knowing why will help. Is this specific to vb play?
 
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scepticus

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2018, 05:43:12 PM »
I agree with kav and Mr.Perfect that it depends on your Bet Selection so there is no Optimum amount of numbers.
PROVIDED it is no more than 17 numbers .
 
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MickyP

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2018, 06:45:48 PM »
I agree with kav and Mr.Perfect that it depends on your Bet Selection so there is no Optimum amount of numbers.
PROVIDED it is no more than 17 numbers .

Scepticus, the general concensus thus far is 7 numbers and not exceeding 10 numbers. I await Mike's  reply on the 10 number boundary. You say a maximum of 17 numbers. Is this from a system/strategy point of view. Please elaborate.

I know it's an unfair question due to different strategy requirements  but to understand bet selection based on the amount of numbers in play could help players better understand why that amount of numbers is played.

I know we are not looking at specific methods or systems/strategies of play but maybe we should for the sake of better understanding the reasons. Let's take the Kavouras strategy that is played with 20 numbers as an example. It is way outside the optimum amount of numbers to play but it boasts great success. Is this an exception to the rule?

Mr j only focuses on playing a few numbers and because he has "zoned in" on this as a standard requirement, he has created a brilliant strategy where the optimum range of play is 1-5 numbers. I like his outlook on roulette; very thought provoking.
 

scepticus

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2018, 08:35:52 PM »
For 17 numbers on a win we get paid better than evens. That is my reasoning.
As for how many numbers to bet ? That ,surely, depends on the chosen method ? 
 
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Jesper

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2018, 10:57:38 AM »
I think it depends of the wheel. A double zero wheel with normal payout, we can not be using so many numbers as a single zero wheel. If NOZ it does not matter.

To visualizing it, we can bet so many numbers we will win one unit. On NOZ we see only one empty slot, on a single zero we see two empty slots, and on the double zero we see three empty slots.

There is a few times higher risk to lose on a double zero betting many numbers, so if we play at such table it is better to use just a few numbers.
 

MrPerfect.

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2018, 01:12:43 PM »
As long as l bet on numbers with high positive expectation, l do not care how many zeroes. These are "included/accounted" in positivity of numbers l gonna bet.
   It's not about HE... it's about players edge and wich numbers are good for it, isn't it?
 

Fyodor

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2018, 01:43:58 PM »
Never play more than 5 numbers per wager, and they are always consecutive numbers on the EU wheel.
Most times I only play 3, with an extra unit on the centre one of the three.
(No outside bets, no splits, no corners, no lines, no streets, just individual numbers, because, when you get it right, the boost is amazing!
(And, so are the returns).
 
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MickyP

Re: Optimum amount of numbers to play.
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2018, 08:21:15 PM »
Visual ballistics seems to dominate the answers to the question and it all swings to few numbers are better to play. However, system players should consider the question when selecting a system/strategy to play.

As I stated in my opening post, playing many numbers should give you more wins but a loss will rob you of several wins. When you loose playing many numbers you are compelled to chase losses to win. It's a very unstable way to play. Many experienced players advise against chasing losses. A progression on many numbers is a bankroll killer.

On the other hand playing a few numbers will not always produce frequent wins but if your stake is let's say 5 times smaller than the payout you have opportunity for a win without play adjustments to chase losses. This is a big advantage to playing less numbers.

Different methods require different betting requirements and you should consider the "payoff" of risk vs reward in the amount of numbers at play.
 
 
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